Angeline M. Hart – Book Journeys Author Interview Transcript – Apr. 28, 2016

Book Journeys Author Interview – April 28, 2016

Dr. Angela Lauria with Angeline M. Hart, author of Gorillas Make Great Lovers: Escape the Dating Jungle and Build a True Love Relationship

 

I don’t care if you don’t write a perfect book. It’s all right. There’s somebody out there that needs to hear what you have to say. ~Angeline M. Hart

 

Angela:

Hey, hey, hey, everybody! It is another journey – book journey that we’re gonna share for you today on Book Journeys Radio. I am super excited to be back. Had a little time off to get married, which is super fun. Hopefully, you guys are following along on Facebook and Snapchat and have seen some of those pictures, and it’s perfect that my first guest, after our wedding celebration should be an amazing expert on building true love relationships. Angeline M. Hart is the author of Gorillas Make Great Lovers: Escape the Dating Jungle and Build a True Love Relationship. I’m so excited we get to talk to Angeline and talk about love today, Angeline, thank you so much for being my guest!

 

Angeline:

My pleasure!

 

Angela:

Awesome! So, let’s just start off by telling everyone about Gorillas Make Great Lovers, what is the book about and who did you write it for?

 

Angeline:

Okay, all right. It’s – it’s kind of a quirky title because it’s … a fun way at looking at the whole dating and love genre out there, and what it refers to is, most women tell me, “I can’t find the right guy.” And so, I came up with a unique way to help them find the right guy by labeling twelve different types of men as animals, one of which is a gorilla. And so, they take a quiz, multiple times, about the different men in their lives and the relationships that haven’t worked, and maybe some that did work for awhile, and also about their ideal man, and that “gorilla” quiz, which anybody can take for free on my website, which is gorillalove.com. That quiz is gonna tell them the manimal type of any man in their life, and also the manimal types of the man that they ideally want to find, and what I do is help them learn how to recognize the kind of man that they want, because they keep finding the kind they don’t want –

 

Angela:

Mmm.

 

Angeline:

– and they just … website unle – So- so, that’s what it’s about, and beyond what most relationship books are doing out there, which is helping people to the dating game, is, I want to help them through the dating game and then on to a long-term love relationship. That’s my goal, and – and our mission, actually, is to change the world, one relationship at a time.

 

Angela:

Aww, look at that!

 

Angeline:

And you can’t do that with a whole bunch of short-term relationships, so it’s – it’s about truly building a long-term, loving relationship.

 

Angela:

I love that, Angeline, I should have said earlier that I know you had a – a co-author and a  partner in writing this book, who is also your partner in life, Dixon Schwenk.

 

Angeline:

Right.

 

Angela:

So, Dixon’s not here, but I wanted to shout out to him, and the quiz you mentioned, people can find that, I believe, at gorillalove.com, can I find it there?

 

Angeline:

Correct. Correct. … as many times as they want.

 

Angela:

Okay, so as we are – as I was gonna say, head over to gorillalove.com, take that quiz and find out what your – either what – what your manimal type is, what your partner’s manimal type is, or what your ideal partner’s manimal type is.

 

Angeline:

Right.

 

Angela:

So, I know I had fun with this. So, my ideal manimal is an owl, and I just married one, so that’s awesome. So, … a lot of people have a dream of writing a book, and one of the challenges, for a lot of people, is picking a topic or structuring – … they might know they wanna write about love, but they don’t really have the – the topic clear, or the structure clear. So, how did you focus on your book and go from the general idea of writing a book to being specific about this book?

 

Angeline:

Well, probably, like most people, I wanted to write a book that would affect as many people as possible, and what your coaching program did for me is to explain that the way to do that is to quit thinking in general terms and, instead, to think in specific terms and, in fact, come up with an ideal client that I would want to read this book, and you had me write it out – literally, write out – a description of an – and I can tell you some of the descriptions I came up with. My ideal client would be, i – in this specific scenario, would be thirty-sixish year old single woman, probably had a negative or even abusive father, has had challenges with finding good men, has had failed relationships, numerous, probably shops at Victoria’s Secret to buy herself things to help make herself feel lovely and sexy and everything, and yet, she imagines that men think she’s … Victoria’s Secret model, and so, she’s unhappy with the way she looks, she goes regularly to work out, she has a good job but she’s not happy with her job because she has issues around setting down, raising, and so, she’s allowing herself to be overworked and underpaid and – it was a real process for me to have to think in terms of a specific person and then write the book that person ….

 

Angela:

Mmm. And did you find that changed the book topic or helped you get more specific in a way that surprised you?

 

Angeline:

It really changed the way that I wrote. It clarified what I had to say – I mean, my general message is the same. The … of the book could have applied to married women who just want to improve the love in their marriage, or – or married women who are having challenges with their husband, and they don’t know whether or not they should stay. It could apply to all of those, because there’s some very basic principles, but it really helped me, as I wrote it, to determine what I needed to say and how I needed to focus that writing. It – it made the writing easier –

 

Angela:

Mmm.

 

Angeline:

– I – I’m a pretty good writer, but it – it really clarified what I needed to say.

 

Angela:

So, once you had clarification about your book, tell us a little about your writing process.  Did you write every day, did you write in short verse or long block, what was your writing schedule like?

 

Angeline:

For me, I wrote every day. I really felt the pressure of needing to get it done on time. … We had a deadline in place, … tight deadline. I wrote every single day, and since I was writing with my husband, what o – our particular process was, I would write in the morning, blah blah blah blah blah, … I got pages and pages and I think it’s pretty darned good. And then, he’d come in, in the afternoon, and sit down at my desk, and he’s facing my computer, and I’m sitting in another chair, a few feet away from him, and he go through and start reading what I wrote, out loud.

 

Angela:

Mmm.

 

Angeline:

… when I finished writing, I would think, “This was good. There’s very few changes needed here,” but he would read it out loud. All of a sudden, oh, my goodness, I can hear that that sentence is convoluted. It’s not clear, need to change that, oh, I need a different word here, and then, he is very good at being a balance for me, ‘cause I’m a very pragmatic writer, and he’s quite a … in the way that he thinks and in the words that he would choose, and so, he would make it much more interesting, much more a – a – feeling, than the kind of writing that I would do, and together, I feel like we would turn out something that was really good. It was amazing to me that I could spend four hours in the morning, think it’s done, think it’s great, think it’s minor changes, and we’d spend another four hours in the afternoon.

 

Angela:

Wow. So, having gone through the process, I know that you are thinking about writing another book.

 

Angeline:

Yes.

 

Angela:

Is there anything that you would do differently this time, having … been through it from the beginning to the end? Any lessons that you’ll take with you?

 

Angeline:

I’m a process-oriented person, I really need to know, step by step, what the expectations are and what to do next, and, okay, now what, and how does this or that fit in with it, and so, now that I understand the overall picture, … work my way through it, I think it would be much easier for me. In addition, I probably should mention that I’m sixty-nine years old, and … pushing at seventy really hard, and I’m not really computer savvy, and so, there were challenges for me in the whole process, because what your … company offers has a lot of technical information, go here to get this, go there to get that, go someplace else and gather this bit of information, it was great support information, but it took a learning curve for me to be able to – to find those pieces that were so helpful when I found them.

 

Angela:

Mmm. Anything else that you would advise someone who was thinking of working with a co-author, in terms of how to structure that?

 

Angeline:

Advice for co-author, well, I – I guess, actually, the … would be – they talk like writing a book is like birthing a baby –

 

Angela:

Mmm.

 

Angeline:

– and everybody’s touchy about their baby, they want everybody else to think it’s beautiful and it’s perfect and – and you don’t want somebody to come up and say, “Well, actually, you need to change this, this didn’t work, and – and when you do that,” and so, the thing that I would say, primarily, is both of you need to be diplomatic with each other. You need to be sensitive and considerate, because it – it is painful, and he would sit there and he would say, “Okay, well, I think it needs to go like this and this and this,” and I’m … “Ah, that’s just …. wanna say, I wanted it to be this and this and that.”

 

Angela:

Mmm.

 

Angeline:

And so, … need to be able to hear each other and feel for each other and not be critical and be able to be patient with each other and supportive of each other in the process.

 

Angela:

Yeah. Great – great advice. So, tell me about the vision you had for your book before you wrote it. What were you imagining, and then, how is that similar or different to what you ended up with?

 

Angeline:

Well, what I was imagining, little book about the size and shape of the book The Secret

 

Angela:

Mm-hm.

 

Angeline:

– and it was gonna be this cute little volume that women were gonna carry in their purse as their reference, as they go out there in the dating world and they’d go back and they’d check and say, “Okay, … in your case, all right, I wanted an owl. Okay … keep looking for such-and-such.” So, I had – I had – it was gonna be all about the manimals. And in reality, it turned out that it’s much bigger than that, it’s deeper than that, it’s not just a reference in the moment, it’s a learning book –

 

Angela:

Mmm.

 

Angeline:

– and as I directed it to my ideal client, which is based on multiple clients that I worked with, and I realized, “Here’s what she needs, here’s what she wants, here’s the kind of help that is best for me to give her.” It turned into a different book than the fun little – funny … that I had originally envisioned.

 

Angela:

Hmm. Fascinating. So, while you were writing your book, were there ever moments that you experienced writer’s block, and if so, how did you deal with that?

 

Angeline:

The first time – it – … other thing that’s really helpful that’s in your program is the Facebook page that everybody is on, and –

 

Angela:

Mmm.

 

Angeline:

– somebody mentioned … that they were worried about writer’s block and I – seems I remember that I said something … “Oh, … not having a problem with that, I’m just rolling right along.” And again, probably about two weeks, bam! And I realized what writer’s block is, at least for me, is a real fear that I’m not doing this quote unquote right.

 

Angela:

Mmm.

 

Angeline:

And that, maybe … mistakes, maybe it’s not good enough and I was – I was checking out other people’s books on relationships and going, “Oh, my goodness, this one’s so wonderful, oh, this has such nice things in it, oh, I like this writer’s style,” and I was thinking, “I don’t have anything to contribute, what makes me think I can do this?”

 

Angela:

Mm.

 

Angeline:

“Why- why do I think I have something to say that people would wanna buy this, why … plenty of good things out there? If it’s -” I was really surprised, because I’m basically a very confident person, and so, to bump into a – a lack of confidence, I hadn’t dealt with that before.

 

Angela:

Mmm.

 

Angeline:

I – I didn’t know what to do with that, and when I mentioned this on the Facebook page, you said something … “Yup, you’re right on schedule, this is about the time that would start showing up.” So, I went, “Oh, okay, this is normal, I’m all right,” and I was able to just move forward.

 

Angela:

Hmm. And were there other – were other ways that you found that you had blocked yourself, … for some people it’s procrastination or confusion? People would be … “Oh, I don’t know what to write now, “that kind of another way that sometimes we keep ourselves safe by not finishing the book? What else – how else did the – the … fear of “Who am I to write this book?” did that show up for you?

 

Angeline:

I didn’t have the confusion thing, because I based the outline of the book on a series of workshops that I’d done, and so, I knew, in general, what needed to be said, and that kind of thing, so I didn’t run into confusion that way. I didn’t run into much procrastination – a little bit, near the end, but mostly I was excited to get it done, wanted to get it done, I’m a “get it done” kind of person, but I noticed, when I got near the end, I – my editor, Kate –

 

Angela:

Mm-hm.

 

Angeline:

– had said, “You need to have a way to wrap this up. You need to have a way that … pulls it all back together at the end.” And that had not been part of my series of workshops, and so, I was a little bit lost, “Okay, how am I gonna do that? What should I do?” and what I did was reach back into the coaching that I do with clients and thought, “What is it that they want from me? What – how – how would I answer this for them?” And what I found with my clients, and what I ended the book with, is actually storage from my personal life, what did and didn’t work, so they could see how these different principles, such as imagined boundaries, communication skills, handling feelings and emotions, how – how do you deal with that in real life, and so, in the – the closing chapter I put in there for – stories such as how I met my husband, and then my follow up comment was, “Did you know this, that one of – here – here’s the way that I knew this man was right for me, did you notice that I saw this about him, and that about him, and this about him and that about them?” so that they can go back and look at this story that I had written about me and – and go, “Ah, okay, all right, I get it, I get it -”

 

Angela:

Mmm.

 

Angeline

– because a lot of the women that I’d talked to, because they’d had poor examples from their father and from their early relationships, they don’t know what a good relationship looks like. They don’t know how to recognize it, they don’t know how to – they say things to me … “How can I tell if this was a good one?” And so, to – to go back and close it with that, and also, my daughter asked me if I did stories about her, because I talk to her to find her mate –

 

Angela:

Oh!

 

Angeline:

– and – and I did the same thing with it. Okay, here’s – here’s how she found him, and here’s the things that helped her know he was right. And – and I found that that feature pulled the whole thing together. Here’s all the principles, blah blah blah blah blah, now, here’s how it all works in real life. And that – that was the only place that I run into procrastination, is when – it was something new that I wasn’t sure how to do –

 

Angela:

Right.

 

Angeline:

– and … ended that way.

 

Angela:

And so, a lot of people think about writing a book, and they never finish it, or they – they never even really get started, in some cases. I know, for you, this was the first time you tried to write a book, right?

 

Angeline:

Right.

 

Angela:

So this is … – you know what they say about small businesses, … ninety-five percent of small businesses, they all – I think about ninety-nine percent of all first-time book attempts fail. Why do you think you were able to finish your book?

 

Angeline:

Angela, it’s your program. There’s no if, ands or buts about that. Not only did your program help me know how to structure the book, helped me know how to focus the book, help me know what things needed to be written into it and not written into it, it also helped me, and I think this is a flat out miracle, helped me have a bestseller book.

 

Angela:

Mmm.

 

Angeline:

I – the rest of my life, I will … to say to anyone, “Yes, I wrote a book, it’s on Amazon and it qualifies as a bestseller.

 

Angela:

Mmm. …

 

Angeline:

That’s phenomenal! I – I have a family member who wrote a book several years ago – years ago! And he’d never gotten it published, I – I think, frankly, he’s probably in shock that I got this thing published and that it’s a bestseller. That’s your program, that’s a hundred percent your program.

 

Angela:

Yup. Have you – have you ever done any other programs, or did you consider any other programs? I just wonder what about the program you think worked.

 

Angeline:

Actually, I had looked at quite a few. I knew I needed to write this book, you mentioned earlier that I have another book that I’m planning to write, and it’s actually a book that I made a promise to my mother that I would write.

 

Angela:

Mmm.

 

Angeline:

My mother, before she died – well, she was a psychologist, and – and quite successful and – and did a lot of public speaking and used a lot of stories, personal stories, when she would speak, and people would come up to her afterwards and say, “Ah, if you ever write a book, … I’m gonna want to buy a copy of it,” and she was a good writer, and she wrote down a bunch of those stories. And before she died, she gave me assignment, “Angeline, I want you to get this published.” I’d never published anything, I – I didn’t … world, and I thought, “Okay, I’m gonna start with something that I can write directly for myself, I’ll just publish a book about the twelve manimals, ‘cause people would ask me to do that.” And I said, “Okay, I’ll write that,” and then I’ll know how to do it and I’ll be able to do Mom’s book.” What happened – I actually lost my train of thought.

 

Angela:

So, I was just saying, what – had you looked at other programs?

 

Angeline:

Yes, yes. So, I was a looking at all these other programs – thank you, I – I went to a big writer’s conference –

 

Angela:

Mm-hm.

 

Angeline:

– and they had – had reps for different publishing houses, and I sat down with several of them. I started looking at – there’s a bunch of different companies out there that want to publish your book, and so, I was checking all these others out, and then I saw your interview with Caroline Greene. And I was so taken with your authentic way of dealing with both her and your audience that you were presenting this interview to, and I thought, “That’s what I want. I wanna work with somebody like that, who’s real, and not just someone who’s just business and promising this and that and the moon, and they’re just all money focused. I really wanna work with someone who is more heart-centered,” and the questions that you had, that you asked her, were so insightful, I was just really impressed with – with you and your perspective. That’s what did it for me, and I just did – at that point, I just dropped all the others that I had been considering.

 

Angela:

Hmm, that’s nice to hear! If you are listening and you wanna know about that, … I did with Caroline Greene, if you e-mail me, [email protected], I will send you a link that you can hear that, too. So, what, so far, has been the best thing to come out of having your book? I know it’s only been, what, about six weeks?

 

Angeline:

Yes, about six weeks, that’s maybe – not even quite that … actually, let’s see, it was March 11 – yes, that’s close to six weeks.

 

Angela:

Yup, okay. So, in the six weeks – obviously, you became a bestseller, that’s a big highlight –

 

Angeline:

Yep.

 

Angela:

– are there conversations you’ve had, or e-mails, people that have reached out to you or views, are there any highlights from the first six weeks of being a best selling author that you can share with us?

 

Angeline:

Mostly, I have been really focused on – I’m g – I’m gonna mention in that, included in your process that you gave to us, besides writing and publishing the book and getting it to be a bestseller, you are unique that, as far as I know, in that you also offered training when we came out there to do the launch and …. My husband and I – you had a training program, three-day program, on how to – not what to do, not how to market your book, how to manage your business, how to actually make something happen with this, and I have been actively working that program – there was so much information you gave us, I had that funnel literally tacked to my wall in the office, and I refer to it daily. So, I have been going through working on that, and it has helped me weed out some of the … programs that are offered to me, saying, “We’ll help you build your business this way and that way.”

 

Angela:

Mmm.

 

Angeline:

Some of them, … their little freebies, initially, I don’t care, I already got that from Angela.I – I already know … done with that now, or, “Okay, I can see how this would take me farther on the path added to” what I learned from you in that three days, so as far as people reaching out to me, I had somebody who wants to respond to me in doing my own radio show, but you have to pay a fee for it, I told him, “Fine, if you’ll put the money up front, I’ll be happy to do it.”

 

Angela:

Right.

 

Angeline:

…. I’m actually getting ready to go – my next step is to put my book in print, because it’s … book right now, and I’m getting together a series of webinars that I wanna do, so I’m just building on the book, that’s the main thing that I’m doing. … I’m really, really working into turning it into a business.

 

Angela:

And, hey, I love it. What was different about writing or publishing your book than you expected? Was there anything in our process that surprised you?

 

Angeline:

Anything that surprised me. I guess two things. When I wrote out the description of my ideal client, … the thirty-six year old who shops at Victoria’s Secret, and I don’t know if you remember what you responded. I posted it in the Facebook page, the private Facebook page, and you said – “I really want to rip this to shreds -”

 

Angela:

Mmm.

 

Angeline:

– because I really like you to be able to find the flaws in it, and you said that this is amazing, you hit it perfectly.

 

Angela:

This was perfect, I remember. We have very few people who do this particular assignment perfect at the first time. Yeah, that was – that was definitely a moment I remember, for sure.

 

Angeline:

Well, that was a surprise to me, because there … said it was perfect, but I tell you, I had literally studied your book.

 

Angela:

Mmm.

 

Angeline:

Because I read your book before I even started the process a – and you later sent me a free copy, now that I’ve signed up for the program. I got another copy of it, but I had bought your book myself after I watched your interview. I bought it myself, read through it, … highlighted some things in it, so I understood the basic program, and maybe that’s one reason that it felt so well for me, because the second surprise was when Kate, my editor – I turned in my first chapter or so, and she responded back and she said, “You have got this down, you totally understand what it is that you’re – need to do, I don’t want to get in your way. I would normally be telling people, okay, now, we’re gonna correct this as we go, we’re gonna make changes and I’ll redirect you, whatever.” She said, “I’m not gonna do that for you, I want you to just write. Just write.”

 

Angela:

Mmm.

 

Angeline:

“… whatever you’ve got, and when we get near the end, then I’ll start working with you, but I’m afraid that if I start making some corrections or redirections now, it’ll slow down your process,” and so, that actually worked really well for me, but I was truly surprised, I wasn’t expecting that kind of response.

 

Angela:

Nice. You gotta –  … the age has to benefit you in some way, all that experience is paying off.

 

Angeline:

Some … , yup.

 

Angela:

In our last couple of minutes, I just wanna ask you – most of our listeners have wanted to write a book for a long time, and most importantly they wanted to make a difference and do something meaningful with the lessons that life has brought to them. What advice would you give that person who wants to write a book but hasn’t been able to finish it?

 

Angeline:

I really believe – I have come to believe, partly through this process, that we really do all have something that the rest of the world, or a bunch of people in the rest of the world, need to hear.

 

Angela:

Mmm.

 

Angeline:

And that that message, we shouldn’t sit on it. That – I think that’s one reason why coaches are becoming so prolific, where you can have people who are licensed therapists and psychotherapists and … turn into coaching, because, from coaching, we get to give more of that personal, “Here’s what I learned through my life. Here’s what my negative experiences have taught me,” and I – I – I think – I – I mean – I think even ten year old kids have wisdom already that, if we would listen, could benefit. So, I would say to all those people, “I don’t care if you don’t write a perfect book. It’s all right. There’s somebody out there that needs to hear what you have to say.”

 

Angela:

Yeah. Absolutely. Angeline Hart is the co-author of Gorillas Make Great Lovers, with her partner, Dixon Schwenk. You can find Gorillas Make Great Lovers at Amazon, check that out right now, and if you want to take her manimal quiz that she talked about at the top of the show, just head over to gorillalove.com. That’s gorillalove.com, Angeline, thank you so much for being with us today.

 

Angeline:

My privilege to get to work with you, Angela, truly.

 

Angela:

Aw, thank you so much. Well, we are actually off next week, because we are doing live our Three Days to Done event, here at the Author Castle in the Washington, D.C. area. We’ll have four authors arriving on Tuesday night and they will leave by sunset on Friday, they will have their books written, and covers for their books, author photo shoots, a book trailer, it’s all gonna happen on the twenty-seventh, twenty-eighth and twenty-ninth. If you go to Facebook and you follow the Author Incubator, you’ll be able to follow our four authors on their journey in lieu of hearing me talk on this program next week, so I will miss you and I hope get to check out Three Days to Done, it’s a really fun process to watch these authors go through it. So, with that, I will leave you with the message I leave you with every week, which is that we are changing the world one book at a time.

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